this is fuckin ridiculous

[gokuDX7 2,871]

This is an interesting documentary of America vs Canada's health care through the eyes of people and doctors from both sides.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ARxjQ3IRqvg]YouTube - Comparing Canadian and American Health Care[/ame]

So basically the poor or unemployed in America want national health care similar to Canada because the government "covers" it and Canadians want a health care where their wait times are as fast and responsive as Americans (ie. they wouldn't mind spending a little extra to cut in lines). It's to bad you cant just merge both systems together. If you did that though it would end up costing people way more and then there would also be the people complaining that their wait times are increasing due to people paying to cut..etc .

Thank god most states have free health care you can get if your unemployed or dirt poor in the US. NH has a system that my dad was on for a while before he started making money again. If your making under 2 grand a month regardless of your status you can get state driven health care for free. The catch is they have to assess your earnings every month and when you or your significant other start making over 2g they cut you from the system. This system is clearly only for single people that are shit out of luck and have no where to turn.

[Khellendross 1,260]

Thank god most states have free health care you can get if your unemployed or dirt poor in the US

I believe they called that medicare, another system the government put into place back in the late 60s early 70s that was railed at by republicans and all the nutjobs out there said would end up putting the govt more in control of your life. Personally, i think Obama needs to grow a pair and instead of just bringing it in to debate about it, pass it through w/o any support from the right. The morons in the town hall meetings that are shouting their heads off in a few years if someone tried taking away this coverage would rail against them too.

You keep saying read the bill. But I dont see anything malevolent in there. So imo let it pass. and let it do the good that it's going to.

[gokuDX7 2,871]

I believe they called that medicare, another system the government put into place back in the late 60s early 70s that was railed at by republicans and all the nutjobs out there said would end up putting the govt more in control of your life. Personally, i think Obama needs to grow a pair and instead of just bringing it in to debate about it, pass it through w/o any support from the right. The morons in the town hall meetings that are shouting their heads off in a few years if someone tried taking away this coverage would rail against them too.

You keep saying read the bill. But I dont see anything malevolent in there. So imo let it pass. and let it do the good that it's going to.

It's not Medicare. Medicare is nation wide and run by the government not the state. State run medical help like NH has is total different and not every state has one. It's also voted on by the people in the state not the government.

There's plenty of malevolent stuff in there. ramble ramble ramble lol

Look at all the stuff related to private health care. In interviews Obama and staff claim it wont effect private run health care but in the bill it's plainly obvious it will. Company's will be taxed for offering public heath (national health care) there's no way out of it. If they want to continue offering private health care they still have to pay for it out of their pockets or your pay checks. In this economy It's redundant to pay for two when you can have one that would cover most things a person would need so obviously company's will ditch private over public. The bill will kill private health care and form a government run monopoly which is very bad. As this is happening waiting times will increase like in Canada, only worse since thousands of people that hold off on going to the doctors will start going within the year this passes. People in need of major things done will be forced to wait unless it's life threatening.

Edited August 23, 2009 by gokuDX7

[Khellendross 1,260]

Personally I dont care much for private health insurers. A few years ago my wife had Starbridge, she was diagnosed with Cervical Cancer. We got on the phone with em and everything was fine, she went through the surgery, was good to go. Starbridge then yanked her coverage and called Cancer a pre-existing condition. I talked to several levels of management before i was able to get them to cover her again. That kind of crap is something i'd love to see ended.

[Sledgstone 8,672]

It's not Medicare. Medicare is nation wide and run by the government not the state. State run medical help like NH has is total different and not every state has one. It's also voted on by the people in the state not the government.

There's plenty of malevolent stuff in there. ramble ramble ramble lol

Look at all the stuff related to private health care. In interviews Obama and staff claim it wont effect private run health care but in the bill it's plainly obvious it will. Company's will be taxed for offering public heath (national health care) there's no way out of it. If they want to continue offering private health care they still have to pay for it out of their pockets or your pay checks. In this economy It's redundant to pay for two when you can have one that would cover most things a person would need so obviously company's will ditch private over public. The bill will kill private health care and form a government run monopoly which is very bad. As this is happening waiting times will increase like in Canada, only worse since thousands of people that hold off on going to the doctors will start going within the year this passes. People in need of major things done will be forced to wait unless it's life threatening.

I just gotta ask... What kind of health coverage do you currently have now?

Over the past 2 years alone my prescription out of pocket costs have doubled, my insurance premiums have gone up about 25% but has increased out of pocket expenses by about 50%. Two to three years ago, we were issued a memo about how we were denied raises for the year due to increasing health coverage costs... Maybe your employer or state has a better insurance provider than the rest of the nation? As it is, I have no cancer coverage at all, thats a separate plan that'll cost me even more money and not give me 100% coverage.

I think something needs to be done with the health industry in the US. Doctors are overpaid, tests are overpriced and we have such great medical care now in the US because the entire nation is paying out its ass for it. There has to be some kind of middle ground. As it is now, if I need a major surgery, I'll probably fly to India to get it done because it'll be cheaper, even with the costs of hotel rooms and plane tickets.

I haven't read this bill. I've glanced at it. Its wrote like the bible. Its all political bullshit. Senators don't want to vote on it because they'll loose huge contributions to their campaigns, other senators aren't in the pockets of the insurance companies. Its all a bunch of bullshit with so much money floating around to battle this bill on both sides that if all those companies put that money into the system instead of battling it, we'd probably have a health care system that works.

[Ladywriter 7,783]

I really don't think a public option is going to have a huge negative effect on private insurance. What will likely result is co's will drop prices(which will attract more customers) and offer business better rates for employees.

The public option will help the uninsured who don't qualify for medicade or medicare; current govt options for low or no cost insurance to those living below the poverty level and the elderly. My gram was denied medicare once over 4 cents. Yes I said CENTS as in pennies. I can name friends and relitives who are arguably piss poor and don't qualify for medicade because they make anywhere from a few bucks to a few hundred over the limit for medicade. The gap between the next to nothing co- pays/premiums of govt insurance and private insurance is thousands of dollars a year that these financially struggling ppl can't afford.

Medicade and medicare have similar drawbacks of private insurance, some docs don't accept that insurance. With a public options more docs not less will re-work policy to include accepting govt insurance thus increasing the # of docs instead of causing the mythical doc shortage some believe in.

Here is a reality/horror story for you... my sis is a hairdresser, her employer provides no insurance option as he 'rents the booth' to his private contractor employees ~then gouges the back bar keeping everyone in that shop uncomfortably broke. Frank is the typical greedy small business owner and an overall asshole.

My sis has a pre existing condition, polyneuritis, her first kidney failure happened when she was 8. This past winter she had to go through the ER for more kidney trouble, this time stones. She's one of the millions w/o insurance and now in debt (the bill was about 3 grand) with medical bills she's making monthly payments on. Not poor enough to qualify for medicade. Not enough income for health care premium costs.

There are millions of people stuck in this group without insurance. We're supposed to be this great nation yet we suck hard at taking care of our own citizens. Health and education systems are a fail. Most people have no problem with the govt run public schools, govt health insurance option would be comparable to a public school vs a private school. You'll get your education/doc visits and quality will depend on where you're going for services. (ex: regents program schools vs jesus rode a dinosaur in Texas)

A public option that works on a sliding scale is the only way to get insurance to the people who desperately need it. Private for profit ins co's don't give a fuck about customers wellbeing and finances, they care about making the maximum amount of money.

[gokuDX7 2,871]

I just gotta ask... What kind of health coverage do you currently have now?

Over the past 2 years alone my prescription out of pocket costs have doubled, my insurance premiums have gone up about 25% but has increased out of pocket expenses by about 50%. Two to three years ago, we were issued a memo about how we were denied raises for the year due to increasing health coverage costs... Maybe your employer or state has a better insurance provider than the rest of the nation? As it is, I have no cancer coverage at all, thats a separate plan that'll cost me even more money and not give me 100% coverage.

I think something needs to be done with the health industry in the US. Doctors are overpaid, tests are overpriced and we have such great medical care now in the US because the entire nation is paying out its ass for it. There has to be some kind of middle ground. As it is now, if I need a major surgery, I'll probably fly to India to get it done because it'll be cheaper, even with the costs of hotel rooms and plane tickets.

I haven't read this bill. I've glanced at it. Its wrote like the bible. Its all political bullshit. Senators don't want to vote on it because they'll loose huge contributions to their campaigns, other senators aren't in the pockets of the insurance companies. Its all a bunch of bullshit with so much money floating around to battle this bill on both sides that if all those companies put that money into the system instead of battling it, we'd probably have a health care system that works.

I've got what you would consider median to high coverage since I didn't want them yanking 280+ from my paycheck for the highest level. I haven't seen any increase in premiums or med costs...but then again if I ever need meds I always get the generic kind. I suppose people with cancer or other serious illnesses may not have a generic alternative. This really isn't the insurance company's fault though. This is more of a patten flaw that America has where if a pharmaceutical company comes up with something they immediately patent it and force people to pay asinine amounts of money to have it. National Health care would run into this flaw as well unless the government says fuck you to the law.

The major problem isn't so much that doctors get payed a lot. It's that people looking for easy cash sue doctors for every little thing which causes doctors to get higher malpractice insurance and other related things to protect themselves. This is of course bad for the rest of us since we feel the increase and blame it on our insurance or doctors. If you cut all that BS out of there and increase jobs that supply insurance for their workers then you solve the bulk of the problem.

I think if Obama wanted to fix the healthcare problem he wouldnt be trying to push goverment run health on everyone but instaid forcing all company's to offer at least basic insurance for their coworkers. Then force states into coming up with their own health plan that non-employed or self employed people could get for a decent price. There are so many diffrent ways to fix the problem that dont involve a goverment run health system.

[Khellendross 1,260]

as far as people sueing doctors, in some cases it actually is Warranted (i've seen cases where they were operating on someone and left shit in the body which caused massive complications later on)

For stupid shit that's the patients own fault though. yeh, its BS. But while yer under and crap happens. yeh.

[Ladywriter 7,783]

big pharma has the privilege of holding the patent for a new super drug for x # of years and making ppl pay out the ass for it. No generic can become available until the patent expires. This is commonly referred to "Do I buy groceries/pay bills or buy meds/treatments I need to live" syndrome. No one should ever have to go through this. The ins co's are making enough profit to cover all Rx not just generic.

Frivolous lawsuits aren't a prob reserved to medical malpractice. Ex stupid woman who burns herself on coffee and sues McD's. Thing is McD's didn't raise the price of a cup of coffee to 5$ to compensate themselves for being dragged into court.

article with video

Today, insured Americans will ultimately pay up to 20 cents on every dollar they spend for health care. However, according to MSNBC host Keith Olbermann on Wednesday night, in its “reform” talks the U.S. Senate is debating if it should allow insurers to increase that figure to as much as 35 cents for every dollar. “In Vegas, they used to call casinos that made more than 20 percent profit a ‘flat store,’” said Olbermann. “The flat store reputation was the kiss of death, because gamblers knew they could get a better deal elsewhere. Today, Nevada laws restrict casino profits to a max of 25 percent. New Jersey casinos take no more than 17 percent profit by law.”

The difference now is, insurance companies may have a real shot at taking much more.

I can't join the insurance co/big pharma pity party yo. They can totally fuck off

[gokuDX7 2,871]

as far as people sueing doctors, in some cases it actually is Warranted (i've seen cases where they were operating on someone and left shit in the body which caused massive complications later on)

That's true but it's been increasing dramatically over the past few years right along with poverty and unemployment. Most cases of malpractice are, in fact, false claims. I have a friend who's been interning at a doctors office for the past two summers. He's seen some real nut jobs come in demanding money or calming they where raped. What's sad is the doctors in the city next to me actually offer their services to the poor but because of the increase in false malpractice claims they've been starting to turn down the people that cant pay.

[Sledgstone 8,672]

Heres an interesting link from NPR. It lets you compare international medical bills so we can see how the US ranks up with other countries health costs:

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=110997469

[Ladywriter 7,783]

Every day we hear new arguments that America should just put off health

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Submitting a photo is really easy, and we provide step-by-step

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[Ladywriter 7,783]

Health Care Reform Town Hall: no room for a centrist

good video